Thread: Philadelphia

Several years ago, at least three major cruise lines (Celebrity, RCCL, and NCL) sailed out of Philadelphia. Today, there are no major cruise lines leaving out of Philadelphia. I was wondering if anyone knows the reason(s) for the decline in interest in this port.

I realize there are certain restrictions when it comes to using this port. The biggest factor I think it clearance under the bridges. While it's true that the newer, larger ships couldn't fit under the bridges, that doesn't mean that older ships couldn't. For example, Carnival's Spirit and Fantasy classes could both fit under our bridges. (That's half of their fleet.)

The other big concern is the time it takes to get to the open ocean. But as far as I know, it takes just as long when sailing out of Baltimore. So what has made Baltimore more attractive to the cruise lines than Philadelphia?

Looking at the benefits, it seems Philadelphia has a lot to offer. The city's biggest asset is its historical and cultural significance. As America's birthplace, there's so much to see in the city. The port itself is very accessable, right off I-95 and very close to the airport. Other popular cities are within a couple hours driving distance including NYC, Atlantic City and the Jersey shore, and Washington DC. For excursions and pre/post cruise stays, this port seems to make a lot of sense.

With the ever-growing popularity of Baltimore and the established port of NYC so close by, I can't see any of the big lines returning to Philadelphia any time soon. Does anyone think otherwise? Is there still a future for cruising out of Philadelphia, or are those days done?

I could be wrong, but I believe that Celebrity and RCCL cruised out of Philadelphia prior to their building of the Cape Liberty Cruise Port.

I agree that there is a huge market for cruise ships leaving out of Philadelphia, NCL's Majesty was the last ship here, prior to her sale, and that ship was fully booked for just about every cruise departing from Philadelphia and even the Suites onboard had no balconies, just picture windows.

I would also love to see a cruise line, preferably with balcony cabins , return to Philadelphia!

Originally Posted by ziggysun

I could be wrong, but I believe that Celebrity and RCCL cruised out of Philadelphia prior to their building of the Cape Liberty Cruise Port.

I agree that there is a huge market for cruise ships leaving out of Philadelphia, NCL's Majesty was the last ship here, prior to her sale, and that ship was fully booked for just about every cruise departing from Philadelphia and even the Suites onboard had no balconies, just picture windows.

I would also love to see a cruise line, preferably with balcony cabins , return to Philadelphia!

We sailed on Celebrity (Horizon) in 2004 from Philly. I don't know if that was before or after the Cape Liberty Cruise Port was built. Either way, it was a great experience. (Yeah, we might've been a bit biased. )

Do you happen to know why Celebrity and RCCL (or any other lines for that matter) pulled out of Philadelphia?

Carnival's do some re-positioning in the next few years, so I'm hoping maybe they'll send a ship up to us. With the Magic and Breeze joining the fleet in the next couple years, maybe they'll have spare ship they could send us.

Here is an article I found on the topic. Seems to shed some light on the reasons for the withdrawing of the majior lines.
Philly has hopes to regain lost cruise business | Philadelphia Inquirer | 12/23/2009

Philly has hopes to regain lost cruise business

By Linda Loyd
Inquirer Staff Writer
Cruise Philly? Maybe not next year.
The Delaware River Port Authority's 2010 budget shows no cruises are booked at the Philadelphia Cruise Terminal at the Navy Yard, although two cruise lines will have port calls here next year.
Philadelphia has never been a major cruising center. But mid-size ships, such as the Norwegian Cruise Line's Majesty, sailed the Delaware River as well as the high seas over the years to Bermuda, Canada and New England.
The cruise business has tailed off from a peak of 35 sailings in 2006 and 32 in 2005 to only eight this year.
As a result of the downturn, the DRPA, a regional transportation agency that also owns and operates bridges, cut its cruise budget 60.5 percent - a decrease of $333,000 - for the coming year. Three employees who worked on cruises will be reassigned to other duties, said the port authority's chief executive, John J. Matheussen.
"I wouldn't say the business is drying up, but at the same time I wouldn't say it's prospering either," he said. "Very soon, we think we might have an announcement that there will be some cruises in 2010, but I just don't have that right now."
The city faces several challenges in attracting cruise-ship business.
Medium-size, 2,400-passenger ocean liners have moved to Europe and European cruises because of the better value of the dollar. And the industry is moving to bigger ships that carry 4,500 to 5,000 passengers. Those mega-ships cannot get under the Delaware Memorial Bridge.
At the same time, Baltimore, Bayonne, N.J., and New York have become much more competitive, increasing the number of cruises they offer, including those to Bermuda.
Philadelphia's location 100 miles up the Delaware River has always been a constraint because cruise ships cannot open up their gambling operations until they get out to the ocean.
And it's faster to get to the ocean from New York, Baltimore and Bayonne.
"I have begged these cruise lines to put a ship into Philadelphia because we can sell it," said Marvin Weber, owner of Marvelous Travel and Cruise Planners in Plymouth Meeting.
"They say, 'Well, maybe you can sell it, but we can't make money.' They can't serve liquor, can't open up the shops, or open the gambling until they are in international waters. The same thing is true coming back," Weber said.
Jim Hughel, president and owner of Town Place Travel and Cruises in Marlton, has sold cruises out of Philadelphia, but not as many as out of New York, North Jersey, Bayonne and Florida.
Philadelphia cruising has always been seasonal, whereas year-around cruises were out of New York. "That's where the business was. They could fill the ships better out of New York City," Hughel said.
For years, Apple Vacations in Newtown Square had a weekly Bermuda cruise from Philadelphia, but not currently.
After the September 2001 terrorist attacks, 12 Royal Caribbean and Celebrity cruise ships were diverted here from the Port of New York, and Philadelphia's cruise business grew.
In 2008, Norwegian Cruise Line's Majesty made Philadelphia its home, offering 10 sailings that year and eight in 2009. But the Majesty was recently sold.
Port authority officials still have high hopes of securing more cruises and port calls, which they say would spur economic development and increase jobs, tourism and related spending on hotels, sightseeing and shopping.
"We have no one booked, but we are talking to some cruise lines," said Timothy M. Pulte, the port authority's chief operating officer. "We had a conversation this week with a cruise ship, and they are very much interested in Philly. We are still pushing it. It's not too late. Our season here is the summer into fall."
The upstream location "does hurt us a little bit. But cruise-ship companies we've talked to are still very interested," he said.
Logistically, cruise companies slot ships and itineraries 12 to 18 months in advance. "We are hopeful we'll have something nailed down at least for 2011, and optimistic, but not sure, for late 2010," Pulte said.
In 1998, the DRPA signed a 20-year lease for about $200,000 a year with the Philadelphia Industrial Development Corp. to operate the cruise terminal, an adjacent pier, and a nearby parking lot.
To offset that cost, the authority rents out the historically registered brick terminal building for weddings, corporate events, parties, and the Philadelphia Antiques Show.
In the meantime, the Greater Philadelphia Tourism Marketing Corp. is still marketing cruises out of Philadelphia to travel groups.
"We believe in the sell that's here," said vice president Sharon Rossi. "If there are no cruises next year, we hope that won't be the case in 2011 and 2012."



Read more: Philly has hopes to regain lost cruise business | Philadelphia Inquirer | 12/23/2009

Thanks for the story Mike. Even though it's a long sail up the Delaware River and they can't open the casino, they could start selling drinks right away, and collecting sales tax on them! Which for this City would be a win-win with it's budget crisis.

My only issue with the Majesty was the lack of balcony cabins since I won't sail without one so we couldn't take advantage of leaving from Philadelphia when she was still here.

that a cruise line will once again decide to make Philadelphia their port for some sailings in the coming years!

Originally Posted by DarkWarriorXII

We sailed on Celebrity (Horizon) in 2004 from Philly. I don't know if that was before or after the Cape Liberty Cruise Port was built. Either way, it was a great experience. (Yeah, we might've been a bit biased. )

Do you happen to know why Celebrity and RCCL (or any other lines for that matter) pulled out of Philadelphia?

Carnival's do some re-positioning in the next few years, so I'm hoping maybe they'll send a ship up to us. With the Magic and Breeze joining the fleet in the next couple years, maybe they'll have spare ship they could send us.

Nothing drove me more crazy than Carnival's big promo in Philadelphia for Baltimore I kept thinking if you want to promote the cruise line here, then bring the ships here!

It would be wonderful if Carnival would do some cruises from Philadelphia since they're my DH's favorite line.

Originally Posted by ziggysun

Nothing drove me more crazy than Carnival's big promo in Philadelphia for Baltimore I kept thinking if you want to promote the cruise line here, then bring the ships here!

It would be wonderful if Carnival would do some cruises from Philadelphia since they're my DH's favorite line.

Exactly. When I heard Carnival was doing an event in Philly, I thought for sure we'd have a ship coming our way. Next thing I knew, Baltimore got a ship. Carnival's my favorite line also, so I got really excited when they did the pinata promo.

Based on that article, it seems the travel time down the river is the biggest obstacle. The bridge clearance is another problem, but as I said earlier there are plenty of smaller ships that can fit.

Another thing I didn't understand is why Philly's cruise season is only summer-fall. The other cruise ports in the area are all year-round. Maybe if they offered options year-round the cruise lines would be more interested? It would require less repositioning on their parts.

On the bright side, they do seem interested in bringing the cruise lines back. Personally, I think if they really wanted them they could get them. I just don't believe bringing the cruises back to Philly is high up on the city's (or DRPA's) list.

Cruises from New Orleans have to travel the river for a 100 miles, it seems they could do the same from Philadelphia. Obviously NYC and Baltimore are more attractive to the cruise lines and they don't feel the need for another port so close to these two. They are both in driving distance of Philly so they don't seem to worried about losing any business from that area.

Originally Posted by kirkz

Cruises from New Orleans have to travel the river for a 100 miles, it seems they could do the same from Philadelphia. Obviously NYC and Baltimore are more attractive to the cruise lines and they don't feel the need for another port so close to these two. They are both in driving distance of Philly so they don't seem to worried about losing any business from that area.

NYC is understandable. But what made Baltimore more attractive than Philadelphia?

Originally Posted by kirkz

Cruises from New Orleans have to travel the river for a 100 miles, it seems they could do the same from Philadelphia. Obviously NYC and Baltimore are more attractive to the cruise lines and they don't feel the need for another port so close to these two. They are both in driving distance of Philly so they don't seem to worried about losing any business from that area.

Not only is it a long ride up the river to get to/from New Orleans, chances are that the ship will be leaning the whole time We went there on a Port Stop and it was an interesting sail both ways!

Even though both Baltimore and NYC are within driving distance, many people do not want to fight that traffic. We opted to fly to San Juan from Philadelphia vs. fighting the congested traffic to leave out of either NYC or Baltimore. Cape Liberty is a little better than NY, but Explorer OTS is the ship leaving from there and it's not our preferred size, it's a little too large for us. I know Celebrity also leaves from there, but that line doesn't seem like the right "fit" for us.