Thread: Going to Europe? Better feed that piggy bank first!!

Oslo tops list of world's most expensive cities
NEW YORK (AP) — Planning a European summer vacation? Save your money.
Eight of the ten costliest cities worldwide are located in Europe, according to a recent survey from The Economist Group.
Oslo topped the list of the most expensive, followed by Paris, Copenhagen, Denmark and London. Two Japanese cities broke into the top ten: Tokyo — which claimed the top spot in 2005 and came in second last year — at fifth and Osaka Kobe at sixth.
Reykjavik, Iceland; Zurich, Switzerland; Frankfurt, Germany and Helsinki, Finland rounded out the ten.
"The strength of European currencies plays a large part," in unseating Tokyo from the top five, said Jon Copestake, the survey's editor. "But prices in Europe are also rising whereas those in Japan have been almost static."
Still dreaming of that trip to Europe? Consider the cheaper European capitals of Greece (Athens tied at No. 55), the Czech Republic (Prague tied at No. 55), Portugal (Lisbon at No. 59), and Poland (Warsaw at No. 63).
It may be an even better idea to stay close to home. The falling dollar and declining inflation made the United States affordable, even for a penny-pincher. New York, the most expensive U.S. city, didn't show up on the list until No. 28. Chicago followed at No. 36 and Los Angeles at No. 41.
Atlanta claimed the title of cheapest U.S. city at No. 84.
Moscow — tied for No.26 with Amsterdam, Netherlands — edged out New York, while two cities in Canada — Vancouver and Montreal — gave the Big Apple a run for its money at Nos. 36 and 39, respectively.
The region of the world that offers the most bang for a dollar is Latin America, which accounts for a quarter of the cheapest 30 cities.
Africa and the Middle East also were home to inexpensive destinations. Except for Abidjan, Cote D'Ivoire and Tel Aviv, Israel, cities in these regions were absent from the costliest 50.
What was the best bargain on the list, and perhaps the least hospitable city for American tourists? Tehran, Iran at No. 132, the least expensive city on the list.
The Economist Intelligence Unit survey compared prices and products in more than 130 cities worldwide and used New York as a base index of 100 for comparisons.
Copyright 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

This article highlights one of the real reasons to cruise to Europe IMHO.

We purchase the cruise in American dollars, and don't have to pay for $600 hotel rooms in Copenhagen, or Oslo. It allows Americans to get a bite of Europe without having to sell the farm!!

I agree! Of course, I'll find any excuse to cruise!!!

Garry

I second that!

I'm going to Paris, London and Venice in March 2008...great, two of them are the most expensive! I'm doing a land trip with my daughter's school...otherwise I'd be cruisin' it there!

The Med cruise and a stopover in Greece is on my list to do for sure...and, according to the post, Greece is down on the list so...yay for cruises!

Gee, where I am going in Sept has 3 on the top 10, That would be Oslo, Helsinki, and Copenhagen. It's a Baltic cruise and we just booked a night in Copenhagen for $169 per person, 4 in a room. Oh well, the cruise is booked so we are going!
I was in Zurich May of 2004 and it wasn't so expensive. They didn't have the euro so exchange rate for the frank was better. We stayed with friends so don't know how much the hotels would have been. Was a great trip.

Carol, hopefully the costs will be considerably lower for you in September since you won't have to worry about accommodations.

And with the current rates of exchange OUCH!

There are many different cost-of-cities-lists all using the different criteria for ranking and this one places Moscow lower than any such list I've seen in a long time.
The dollar has fallen a lot against the euro, Ruble and Pound quite a bit so cruising, based on dollars is a better deal than ever. I've seen my personal purchasing power drop 40% in the last year here in my adopted home of St Petersburg Russia due to the double whammy of an income based on the dropping dollar and living expenses based on the booming Russian economy. One nice development in Europe for the travelers has been the growth of incredibly cheap air fares inside Europe from a whole host of regional no-frills airlines. This has caused the concept of the 3day getaway weekend cheaper and almost more common than staying at home for Europeans. It was a major headache and cost to fly to Europe from my native California but here, anywhere in Europe is within 3 hours by air and under $100.
The strength of the European and Russian economies has reinforced the simple fact that cruising is the cheapest "hotel" in Europe or the Baltic region. It is an even better deal for Europeans, South Americans and Asians who are starting to cruise at rapidly increasing rates. The value of their money combined with the competitiveness of US based cruise lines have been seen as a true bargain by travelers from these other regions.
The current exchange rate in St Petersburg; $1 buys 25.2 Rubles, down from 29 not long ago.

Stan, Don't tell everyone that! I don't want the crusie lines to increase prices before I get to cruise Norhtern Europe.

I have heard that hotels in Moscow are outrageous because there are too few for the large demand. What are your impressions?

Originally Posted by nealberk

Stan, Don't tell everyone that! I don't want the crusie lines to increase prices before I get to cruise Norhtern Europe.

I have heard that hotels in Moscow are outrageous because there are too few for the large demand. What are your impressions?

The cruise lines will not increase prices for standard room, that is what they compete on. Scan the Sunday travel section of major newspapers and you can see they, and travel agencies post the main promotion item as price. Travelers and consumers in general place a high importance on base price without looking at true costs. A standard inside cabin on one ship will get a lot more bookings than another ship which is $100 more. But the true costs of the total vacation might show the $100 more expensive cabin to be $1000's lower.
The best deal are those rare situations where people refrain from putting any more than mandatory on their shipboard credit card account. That where the profit is for cruise lines. Typically the amount charged for shore excursions, premium services, shopping aboard ship, spas, internet and such add up to close to the cost of the cruise itself.
Here in the Baltic Sea one regional cruise/ferry company used to charge only $35 for a very nice cabin in a very nice modern ship visiting the major Baltic ports by charging for everything else;meals, the disco, duty free shopping, stage shows, spa, swimming pool etc and ended up with as much gross sales as when they were all inclusive for a much higher price. I went on it a couple times and loved it but costs added up fast.

The shore excursions are the most profit making for the cruise lines but few people consider them before selecting the cruise and cabin based on price. Some cruise lines offer similar shore excursions for 1/2 the price of others. All the ships do whatever the sales department can think of to intimidate their passengers into taking only ship sold shore excursions but a growing number of people, on average about 25% of the ship's passengers book independent tours from other sources usually for a big savings. Five years ago, few people choose independent tours but now that forums like this offer the opportunity to exchange ideas and experiences, the small private tours have become very popular.

Moscow hotels are expensive because every service, supply source and item of overhead is very high. Most goods are imported with high duties and a 18%VAT making a hotel with western furniture, food, fit and trim items has an operating overhead 40-60% higher than a similar level European or American hotel. Adding in the seasonal nature of hotels in Moscow means prices in summer are set to pay for low occupancy level of the winter. St Petersburg has even fewer people visiting in winter and spring than Moscow so hotels need set their summer prices by taking total yearly incomes divided by only 4 months of full occupancy income. If the same hotel was in an area with an extended visitor season could charge much less for the same overhead.
But anyway you slice it, Moscow is awash with silly amounts of disposable money so many locals buy based on price....the higher the more desirable. The number of people so go out to trendy discos every night wearing $40,000 in clothes and jewelry, arriving in a $350,000 sports car(a Maserati or Ferrari is twice to 3 times what the same car costs across the border) or Bentley and dropping $3000 in entrance fees and drinks is surprisingly large. Much of the retail and service industries cater to this segment of the market. The real growth area of the economy is the fast growing middle class and that has spawned an explosion of discount shopping centers, sales, working and middle class cafes and restaurants, entertainment or recreation centers and travel services.
St Petersburg is not as wealthy but still there are 5 times the Ferrari's and 10 times the Bentleys than back home in the San Francisco Bay Area...all bought with cash and not on credit or leases.
All this boils down to bringing a BIG piggy bank, learn about have to find bargains, consider alternative visiting styles or coming on a cruise ship as the best option. By alternative visiting styles I mean renting a private apartment, using a Hostel or home-stay service or accepting a lower level of hotel than you would anywhere else to keep prices within reason.
If one is aware of how to keep costs in control visiting and experiencing either of these two cities will be a highlight of anyones travel memories. St Petersburg in particular is unique and a must see.